Talk:Arriva Yorkshire

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Image:Arriva (logo).gif is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in Wikipedia articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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We have a dispute about this section. This seems fair comment, is better sourced than the rest of the article and very much concerns the bus company so the suggestion that this is a WP:COATRACK seems incorrect. I am reverting accordingly. Colonel Warden (talk) 10:29, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

No, it really isn't suitable. We've got more about the company than their operation. And, speaking as a local, that was a one-off event that was quickly forgotten. Sceptre ^(talk) 11:20, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Notability does not expire. Anyway it seems clear that you have not forgotten it. :) Colonel Warden (talk) 12:50, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

And what is the "entirely different subject" that you claim is hung here? Even if we spin off the goth incident into a separate article, it should still be linked to here. Since the article is currently of modest size, we seem fine as we are. Colonel Warden (talk) 12:59, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

We're talking about Arriva Yorkshire, not the goth incident. If this was a company-wide policy, sure, it might warrant a mention, but this is just one pissed-off driver. Irrelevant to the company's operation. Sceptre ^(talk) 16:02, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Your reasoning for removal is flawed because other members of Arriva besides the bus driver had to get involved, including Operations director for Arriva Yorkshire, Paul Adcock. The incident factually reveals how the bus company itself at different levels responds to the Goths. --Firefly322 (talk) 17:24, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Surely the fact it appeared in the national press makes it quite notable, even if some of the info could be scaled down? Arriva436^talk 18:43, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I don't see what makes this "low-level employee's stupidity makes page 26 of the Daily Mail, MD issues apologetic statement to save face" incident worthy of having an article. If we did that, half of the MBC pages would be filled with these "controversies". Sceptre ^(talk) 19:22, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I clearly remember it appearing in the telegraph quite prominently, here's the link to the internet version. Arriva436^talk 20:12, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I was being slightly facetious - these sorts of things appear in the newspaper all the time around fifteen to twenty pages in and are forgotten about one day after. Sceptre ^(talk) 22:15, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I have posted another source which demonstrates that the matter was not forgotten. The treament by Arriva of its prospective passengers seems a natural detail to include here. No coats have been produced by Sceptre and so I shall remove the coatrack tag. Colonel Warden (talk) 19:15, 9 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Sceptre now places a neutrality disputed tag, claiming undue weight. He is invited to debate the matter since, failing any substantive point to address, this tag too must go. So that we may consider the full range of reportage upon this company, here is a search of the sources:

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Burden of evidence is to prove it is not undue weight. I believe that it is, because of the following factors:

• Only one dispute with a company that runs several thousand buses per day.
• Discrimination is not company policy by legal definition; it's just a pissed off bus driver.
• The section comprises of 50% of the page, and is placed higher than their business activities.
• Locally, the story was relatively small.
• It's fishwrapper news; easily forgotten after a few days.

These points taken, do you care to explain how it's suitable for the article? Sceptre ^(talk) 16:56, 18 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• We go by the weight of the sources. Since the only sources in this article are the ones that I have researched to support the matter in question, this is the only supported content and it is the other material that is questionable. I am removing the NPOV tag since all you offer as evidence is your own personal opinions, such as the fishwrapper jibe. Colonel Warden (talk) 17:18, 18 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

  It's undue weight not because of the sources, but because Arriva are a bus company, not Bigots-R-Us. Sceptre ^(talk) 18:09, 18 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I don't really think the section needs to be quite that big. While I don't share Sceptre's zeal, I do think it needs to be cut down. 50 percent of the prose in an article about a bus company shouldn't be about a small, localized story; it especially doesn't need to have an extended quote from the company. Celarnor ^{Talk to me} 18:16, 18 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Celarnor in that it should be cut down, however, not removed entirely. It is notable, but it shouldn't take over the article!! Arriva436^talk 19:54, 18 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Currently, this section is the only part of the article which is properly sourced. It seems that User:Sceptre has retired under a cloud and so I sought to remove this tag which he placed. User:Arriva436 wishes to retain the tag. He is a bus enthusiast and his user name perhaps indicates some degree of advocacy for the company. He is welcome to his opinion but we need more than this to retain the tag which should only be a temporary flag not a permanent fixture. We need some justification and specifics. In what way is the presentation not neutral? 17:22, 23 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

If you really wish to tag the tag off, then please do. I just feel that it is still partly biased, and doesn't give the other side of the argument. My username is more my local bus route than me working for the company, which is also why I have done most edits to Southern Vectis, part of Go-Ahead!!! Arriva436^talk 17:26, 23 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I have been going through Flickr and have found and uploaded some additional images of Arriva Yorkshire buses, that were licensed so they could be used here. I was thinking that perhaps we could have a more modern bus in the infobox, and move the older Oly image down? Anyway, the selection of images is at Commons:Category:Arriva Yorkshire, if you want to have a look and see which one's best. Arriva436^{talk/contribs} 13:13, 27 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Arriva Yorkshire/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Last edited at 16:08, 25 January 2008 (UTC). Substituted at 08:17, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

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